Hey Dav I would be willing to buy you some pompoms to go with your cheerleading. How could you possibly do without? All in good fun right?

EDIT: I did mean that as an anecdote. You know I respect you Dav, right?

_________________
*Warning: all of the above is from a flaming, bleeding heart, genocide apologetic, whiney, tool, who is going to over-generalize that all conservatives are anti-family, money hungry, self-absorbed, murderous fanatics, who want nothing but to steal children away from mothers to indoctrinate them in the military to create a new perfect order. Sorry, it's "the facist in me."

ACLU Execution Watch

I would like to, non-objectively, point out several things. (Dav, I truly have nothing against you, but I must point out several things)

Firstly, due to the attidue enforcement you yourself upheld as far as TT went, Dav, I find your post rude, and filled with inntended attacks upon retardomontalban. In fact, it is my understanding that quoteland is not to permit that. Would this mean montalban is out of bounds too? Yes. However, you are the moderator and are expected to exercise greater control, and therefore should not be stooping to whatever level you feel other members are on.

You speak of how the member's let things get out of hand, but how can you say that?

As sentra said in a different thread

quote:

---

it was because of the attitude, bickering and plain mudslinging that finally took its toll. Almost two months ago new rules were set in place to turn this issue around. Nothing happened, in fact it may have become worse.

---

While this is all fine and dandy in its outward appearance, the problem directs itself to the moderators.

New rules were written, yes, but were they enforced effectively? It seemed (especially at the end) that selective enforcement was being used to moderate.

Also, if you cannot handle the heat some members give you, I would request that you step down from being a moderator. It is your job to enforce the rules (against foe and friend), and if you cannot handle that responsibility, you should step down.

However, I cannot completely judge your competence as a moderator because I did not see enough of your posts in the DF (just the more recent ones, and super old ones when I participated on a few threads way back when).

You made a comment that members are not expected to pay for this site and should therefore be expected to take what handouts and rules the site would impose- regardless of how fair and or "right" those actions are.

Well, might I point out that no one is paying, nor enforcing you to be a moderator? If you feel that the members are letting the site go to hell, but you don't have to care is, as someone said earlier, a crock of shit.

It is the moderator and administrators duties (duties) to run this site for the benefit of others. No one is required to be a mod or admin and if they cannot handle the responsibility of directing members in a more harmonious way, then they should step down, rather then stepping behind the scenes to let the storm blow by.

I will not let this storm blow by so you (you figuratively to include all enforcers) will be able to wait it out. And its not like you do your job alone. Sure there are 26000+ members, but I would venture to say that not even 2/3 of them participate regularly. Members who are more senior, or who have been here a while take some of your job away for you. I cannot count the times I have directed newbies to the proper course of action, nor can I count the times I have seen members such as LWNS, FUZZIES, THE TABLIEST, SANYA, D_W, CB, LOST_BUTTERFLY, AOWB- who sadly doesn't come around much anymore but I do not blame her, LADON, TWISTER, KO, KATELYN the list goes on and on and on. And while we can't edit or move posts, we many times make the job of the moderators just that, and only that. By the time insightful members have replied, the mods are far behind in comparison and is probably due to their smaller number.

You have no right to complain about the enforcement of policy.

And while I will admit to nothing more recently (because I did make more of an effort to calm myself), when I used to participate in a few specific debates, there should have been no other action that to discipline or enforce policy on my actions, but I remained untouched. But then again, if you'd have known I would have sided with TABLIEST, you would have kept a closer watch, eh? (that is a very unfair statement, and yet, even if it is hyperbole, it needed to be spoken).

The main animosity that exists, exists because of lack of enforcement of site rules, and the moderators own actions.

I cannot criticize all, or most mods, but there is a small collective few.

Yes, we should keep the debate forum AND REOPEN IT. You remind me of a bunch of scared government officials. You fear what you don't understand or cannot control, and then if things get too out of hand, you simply nuke the porblem- problem solved right? WRONG! The fallout from this action will spread to many members. Already you can see how its radiation is mutating once docile and humble members in angry beasts.

The saddest thing of all is, you, Dav, advocate other members seeing the truth that is was only the members who did such atrocious things, when you yourself cannot open your eyes to the seriousness of the part the moderators and admins played.

You can't build a faulty foundation for a building then blame all those who have visited that building for the reason of its collaspe. You can only blame the construction workers, the builders, the enforcers. And while some members may sabotage that foundation further, it crumbles because of the ill-mannered way it was created and run, not by the damage already added to a damaged base.

Consider that the next you think that its the members fault.



Note: I will be saving a copy of this post, so no one attempt to edit it. I will merely post it again, and your efforts will be in vain.

HAVE A NICE DAY!

~Aeras

Do you think all the time? If not, your existence may be in jeopardy!

Dav, first of all, where is your reply to this, you jumped right on retardo, why not me?

Second where is TN.

TN, its time you step forward and join the discussion, whether your hiding or not, we want NO MORE!

You guys will keep cutting off branches until you think the tree is fit, but only when the job is done, you'll see your work and regret it. Can't do much with a lifeless stump can you?

Or think of it this way. You provided the wood from the branch of quoteland that was the Debate forum, and now that fires raging. You supplied the fuel, you cannot say you were surprised at the result.

HAVE A NICE DAY!

~Aeras

Do you think all the time? If not, your existence may be in jeopardy!

Good imagery Aeras.

_________________
*Warning: all of the above is from a flaming, bleeding heart, genocide apologetic, whiney, tool, who is going to over-generalize that all conservatives are anti-family, money hungry, self-absorbed, murderous fanatics, who want nothing but to steal children away from mothers to indoctrinate them in the military to create a new perfect order. Sorry, it's "the facist in me."

ACLU Execution Watch

I never thought I'd agree with Aeras, but his larger post above, in a just world, would get a "sticky".

But then he isn't, perhaps, as knowledgeable as some of us when it comes to the habits of our oppressors. He asks where TN is. I'm telling you, this absence is quintessential TN.

TN's habit has always been to blow shit up or lock it down but never ever have courage to defend those actions with words. No, that would level the playing field. Instead, we get a bold text "update" and, for good measure, a conveniently-timed thread devoted to the blameless Zendam, who certainly deserves accolades, but that is not the point. The point is that it was a great distraction.

Aeras, there is an old thread in DF where TN's "What I Say Goes and I don't have to justify ANYTHING" crap was attacked. What did he do to reply? Nothing. The climate at the time was that David had forbid the thread from being shut down (always TN's first best choice). so instead TN replied to the effect that members had a right to air their grievances, and it was heavily hinted that this right was a charitible gift of the mods (translation: grovel before me, peons!). So grievances were aired and some of TN's riper comments were justly skewered.

And nothing happened.

So you may take it that this DF decision, like many others, is indefensible. One would think that if they were so just they could be better defended, but I guess that's asking too much of such a sagacious person who has far better things to do with his time.

The fact is that TN is every bit that hothead that he accuses me and theTableist of being. I was once banned by TN and TN alone because he just "didn't like my style", which was "inflammatory". Hey, if THAT can be reason to pull a trigger when no one expects it, then I suppose I cant be really suprised that the DF is shut down just because TN dislikes it. To his credit, he let me back in, but then that's also a habit, too: wantonly blow shit up, wait to see the reponse, repair things if politics demand it. Then, save shit up for a rainy day.


I suggest a boycott. The DF people who dispute this decision, well, don't post on any other forum until things are set straight. And spam the crap out of any thread in which TN circulates the lie that Quoteland is owned/controlled/for its users. If he wants to engage in this sort pettiness, it's his prerogative; but he has no right to lie about QL policy, which is NOT for us, but BY his whim and it only.

P.S.: I take delight in certain others from, shall we say, other QL-ripoff sites, who suddenly have a problem with tyrranic mods and who also wish to hastily convey "I Told You So!" commentary. Whatever Dav's faults for going along with TN's BS on this issue, he was a damn good moderator and allowed a lot from the rightwing wingnuts that wouldn't be allowed if posted by lefties on certain sites maintained by jingoistic nitwits.

My Crap
http://elementropy.blogspot.com/

Some great posts here. Good ideas and thoughtful sentiments. We may bicker and hold strongly opposed stances on the debate forum, we all share a common belief in the importance of the forum that provides us with a stage in which we can debate these differing ideas and ideals. It is a thoroughly important component of any moderately intellectual community - a forum in which we can debate our intellectual differences.

Ironically, it is in our heated moments that we learn and grow the most- we learn about one another, how we differ in opinion and why so. How can you justify the closing of this integral aspect of the Quoteland society?



No falsehood is so fatal as that which is made an article of faith.Thomas
Paine

Yes, I do read these threads. No, I will not respond to any attacks on me. I am taking responsibility for spearheading the shut-down of the Debate forum, though it was not my sole decision to finally do so.
There is no discussion for me to participate in. I have not indicated that there will ever be any change in this decision. The Debate forum that was created on Quoteland is closed forever.
And when I said "totally deleted" I was meaning that the Debate forum will not remain visible forever. It will eventually be archived and hidden, but not deleted.
Oh, and so as not to disappoint any of you that think I just like to go around locking threads, this thread is now locked.
There is no debate as to whether or not the Debate forum will be re-opened.